dr's thoughts

Started by dr

dr

Once again I feel as though I am forced to defend myself. While I hope that most of you don't think the same way as the few overly vocal people, I'll post a few thoughts in response to an e-mail I received.

Apparantly I have issued a gag order on the site. No, I have not. I asked that you not accuse each other publically because all that happens is that people get mad. A full three days before this all blew up, Pooga emailed me privately asking if I had looked at the hits as he was wondering if some might not be questionable. He didn't complain on the forum, he asked me in an email. The forums were set up to chit-chat with each other, about your collections, about how you mark your bills, about your hits, or about the huge dump of snow that Calgary got. They are not a place for attacking each other or bickering back and forth. No one wants to read that and no one certainly wants to be on the receiving end of an attack.

Did I attack anyone? No, I simply said not to question people or accuse them publically. We actually have a law against that (libel). Not to mention that it makes people feel bad and then they don't ever come back.

I re-read my original post again and I don't think I would change the wording. I make a simple request.

And finally, I am so tired of hearing this "it's a free country" line. Ya, I'm a soldier. And yes, I am prepared to defend our freedoms. And yes, I know what those freedoms are and what soldiers have done in the past. And while this site is for all of us to use, it is still my property and I make the rules. I'm not gagging your freedom, I make and enforce some rules to make better for everyone. If you don't think this is necessary check out the chaos in Iraq right now. And before you whine and complain about it, go look at what a mess some other message boards are. People hang around this forum because it's clean, information and insightful and they don't have to sift through a large about of junk in order to read the "good stuff".

I would love it if I didn't have to do any enforcing, as that would mean more time for programming. I am not power hungry, I'm programming hungry.

So if you don't want to hang around here anymore because I want to make this site a cool money tracking site that is informative, insightful, and most of all fun, but with a few rules and requests in order to keep it that way, well, I don't mind. You can't please everyone and in any community, ours included, there will always be some dissidents.
-dr

P.S. Maybe I have some unlying hidden issues, who knows. What do you think Seretonin? Do I have issues or what? :)

wally69me

My thoughts on this is..it is a public forum…put here for all users to enjoy….any problems with individuals should be addressed privately. I for one do not want to see everybody's dirty laundry. Amen!

white_owl

Just if anyone is interested, here is the letter that dr is refering to. Do with it what you please. Thanks for the great time. It was fun while it lasted. I'm gone!

Hi there

First of all, I would like to thank everyone who sent me some words of encouragement through e-mail. It was very much appreciated and it touched my heart.

And just to clear something up, this letter is going to every one of you but it's not my place to disseminate e-mail addresses so it is sent to myself with a bcc to everyone who e-mailed me and a bcc to dr. (Just in case anyone was wondering about the header.)

First, I just want to make sure that I've made myself 110% clear on this point:
I DO NOT question Bishop's integrity. I applaud his achievement and I hope that this trend continues. I was questioning the BILL, not the USER. Just think about it for a minute. Forget who the people involved are and forget all that has gone on in the forums in the last few days and just look at the facts. A bill get 4 anonymous hits within 24 hours. Does this not "raise a few eyebrows"? This is the ONLY point I was trying to make.

My reference to Bishop/Nixon was a little hot headed and maybe I shouldn't have said that. But when there's a bank robbery, the first person the police go after is the one running away from the building. Even if you are absolutely positive of this person's innocence because you were having coffee with him next door when the alarm sounded you have to ask him 'But why did you run?'

When I walked away from the site, my main reason at the time was because of all the attacks that I had gotten in the forums.
After a few days of cooling down, this isn't bothering me as much anymore. I'm thick skinned enough to let this roll and if it were the only issue, I'd probably come back to the site.

There is a bigger issue that has come to the surface and that is the general gag order that dr has placed on everyone. This policy is WRONG regardless how you look at it. I have always disagreed with this policy but I have never said anything before. dr has made a point of this three times since I've been on the site. The first time was as a general comment to everyone, the second was during the 21MDB/Jake incident and mine was the third. I should have said something when he gagged 21MDB/Jake. I didn't and I regret my decision at the time and apologize to those two users. I had a post written out on my word processor but chose not to post it because I felt that I was still too new to the site at the time to be stirring the pot.

As I have stated, there is nothing wrong with voicing an opposing (or "negative") view on an issue as long as it is done in an adult and civilized manner. This opens a healthy debate which is necessary for any level of progress. But it is wrong to issue a general gag order. We are all adults and we are capable of monitoring ourselves. If I were to post something like 'this user is an idiot' or 'that user doesn't know what he's doing' then it wouldn't be long before other users would tell me to clean it up and voice my opinions in a more diplomatic manner.

Here is an excerpt of the letter that I wrote to my teammates on April 28
{begin}
There is gag order that dr imposes on everyone who doesn't agree with his preset concepts. We are very fortunate to live in a country that allows us to voice our opinions. In fact, our entire system of government is based on the opposition questioning the party in power. The profession that I respect the most is the soldier. He goes to work everyday not knowing if he'll be sent to the latest "hot spot" to fight for this very principle. And he may not come back. Many good men in the past have died so that you and I could enjoy this freedom. I once heard on a documentary 'If not for the events of D-Day, there could well be a swastika flying over Parliament Hill today.' I think that was Pierre Burton but I could be wrong. One of my hobbies is the
study of history and I have studied WWII in great detail and I agree with this statement. Yet dr, who is a soldier, stifles this very freedom. He did it to 21MDB and Jake the Drifter and now to me. I find this hypocritical.
{end}

Here is an example of what can come out of a 'negative' opinion.
April 8,2003: I posted a message on the Geocaching forum pointing out a user (handle: Snoogans) and asking if what he was doing was correct. I was not questioning his integrity but his procedure.
In the next three days, this post was viewed by over 300 people with 9 replies. All of the replies had two things in common:
they were all polite and they all said basically 'white owl, you're wrong'. A few went a little further and said 'are you aware of {procedural policy detail)?' I was not aware of these details.
April 14: I posted another message acknowledging that I was wrong and thanking everyone who had replied. This brought
closure to the issue. (Or so it seemed.)

April 28 11pm: I sat down and, over 2 hours, composed my CMT post that became 'My turn!' and another hour composing
the letter to my teammates. By 2 am I was done and sent both out with some regrets. I gave my e-mail a last check before I turned in and, with the timing of a Hollywood movie, there was a letter from Snoogans. It was an up-beat letter in which he basically said 'I have a master plan for what I'm doing. This is what it is …. ta-dah …. ta-dah …. ta-dah …. and would you be interested in partnering with me on a leg of this plan?' COOL! What an interesting and well thought out plan! This sounds like fun. Yes, I'm interested.

If you want to check out this thread, you can find it here:
http://ubbx.groundspeak.com/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=5726007311&f=6016058331&m=16560105 or if this link doesn't work, go to www.geocaching.com, click on 'Discuss Geocaching' on the left bar
forum: The Travel Bug
topic: What does everyone else think?
topic starter: white_owl

So what happened here?
1) I got an education
2) Of the 300 "view" others got an education
3) Snoogans and I became 'teammates' on a leg of his plan.
4) The Geocaching community in general benefits and grows because of all three above.

Yet on CMT, when a post is 'negative', it gets mis-interpreted and blown way out of proportion and dr issues a gag order. I say again: THIS IS WRONG!

I've had a lot of fun on CMT and I may consider returning to the site but only if the general gag order is lifted and we are given the right to freely voice our opinions. Of course with the stipulation that we remain civilized about it.

I am considering posting my views on the CMT forum in hopes of opening a HEALTHY, CIVILIZED AND CONSTRUCTIVE, debate on the issue. I would consider this as a 'gift' to the CMT community.

Again, thank you for your time and your support.
White Owl

BDKINGSTON

White_owl… I hope that you nor anyone else leaves the site over these misunderstandings… After all we are all here for the fun of tracking bills and the chat on the site..Or at least I know I am….

SexyChick

Sounds like some pretty heavy stuff has been going on around here, now it may not be my place, but that has never stopped me in the past, This place looks like it could be very fun why not concentrate on that and let the ego's slide.

As for if you have Issues… Probably nothing 6-10 Tequila Shots couldn't fix (G)

(kisses)

SC

wally69me

oh my DR…..it looks like sexychick is after you….sending you kisses and all…..lol :)

OOOPS…..sorry dr… i see she signs them all with kisses

Serotonin

You seem pretty stable to me, dr. My short answer is that this site has survived and thrived under the guidelines and regulations designed by you with input from senior members.

dr

Heh, I bet you're just saying those nice things Serotonin because you don't want to feel "the wrath of dr." :)
-dr

Serotonin

nope. But I chuckled at your perception. I have made some interesting observations over the past 1 1/2 years though about this interesting medium called internet forums.

dr

Well I'm glad I could provide you with a laugh.

What do you concentrate on research/teaching-wise at U of A, BTW? I've always thought about going back to do a masters because I would love to do some work with AI or cryptography. Good stuff.
-dr

Bish0p

Serotonin, just wait till we lets the bunch loose in a live chat room… I wonder what observations might be had then. :)

Bish0p

Serotonin

my area of expertise is with drug therapy (psychopharmacology). I also manage the ECT (electroconvulsive therapy) program for the University Hospital. Teach residents in training in the Faculty of Medicine as well as medical students who seem to be getting younger each year. Overall, a satisfying career which I can recall researching diligently in Grade 10 Occupations Course. I intend to work until I'm 79.

kaiser

This site is the idle republic. All the little peoples(the users) say, suggest, or announce their thoughts in any possible way, and the officials(senior users), relay these in more diligent form to the leader(Dr). He then considers, revises, finds out if its acceptable, and makes it law.

If only the government could work this way. Then we'd be in a "perfect" world.

Pooga

After being publicly silent on the 'incident', I was chatting about it with dr the other day. I have decided to post an excerpt of that conversation. No further comment is necessary.

After reading the public and private stuff that has been going on, here is my assessment:
Some people were "threatened" by the speed and quantity of BishOp's hits. Call it a CMT "Shock and Awe" event! :-)
I think that you have edited some of the multiple hits but this is a rough idea of the progression… April 18 - 1 hit,
A20-2,
A21-2,
A22-2,
A23-12,
A24-8,
A25-15,
A26-12 (I think that this was his '19' day),
A27-8,
A28-5,
So what we have is something that has not been seen around here before, a sudden spurt of ANONYMOUS (58/60???) hits, trailing off quickly, with one suspect bill (any one of these events could have and has happened to anyone!). So we have 3 separate 'events' happening all at once drawing attention. Questions were asked about the bill by white_owl, the quantity by 21 and the 'anonymous' ratio by several others. Taken together they might well seem like an 'attack'. But on on individual basis, they are questions asked by just about everyone about just about everyone else! As you said, "I might have overreacted", and I think that several people are guilty of this. But this has progressed to another level. I was going to get into the conversation, but am actually afraid to take part for fear of being 'jumped on' for a casual comment that would be misunderstood. So I am sending this directly to you instead.
Perhaps Serotonin could acted as a 'mediator' (announcement of Rules of Engagement… er… Posting?), we can start fresh (archive ALL messages!), and try to put this behind us.
Remember that we all have made 'errors' at one time or another. The flak after Sarge with his WW invitation, the upset users after my Saskatoon Manifesto, and do I have to remind you about the headaches caused by the infamous 6-hit bill?
——————-
My 3 cents, for what it's worth. (inflation you know)

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